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Arnold's Dilemma

Think Arnold is happy he's Governor of California now?

If he does the right thing and does not grant clemency to convicted quadruple-murderer and founder of the Crips gang Tookie Wilson, half the state will be mad at him. Some will accuse him of racism. And there are fears of riots in Los Angeles.

If he does grant clemency, he'll be forever stained as the wimp who backed down in the face of a clever publicity campaign.

Tookie Wilson has never apologized for the murders he committed. Gun murders, at close range. For years, he has brazened it out, saying its all a setup. Well, then, the good works he has committed since his incarceration ( working to reduce gang violence ) mean nothing at all. The only issue is whether he was wrongly convicted. If he was justly convicted, then, in the absence of any contrition, he deserves the maximum penalty.

Either way, Arnold takes a big hit this coming Tuesday. This is what is known as a Hobson's Choice or a Morton's Fork. Arnold, are you happy that you're the governor?

new testment say forgiveness . and i think he is atoning for his crime's maybe the one he is accused of or the others he is nt. by trying and stop kids joinging gangs ifs there is a chance he's innocent then he should not be excuted and if he did life in jail where he can give his message should be the call.

I do disagree.

I could believe he has atoned, but he never admitted that he committed the murders. He says he is innocent, but when do murderers admit their guilt? Rarely, very rarely.

This is a case that has gone through all the appeals. Justice prevails tomorrow.

true they rarly admit the crimes but what is atonement it is trying to make up for past deeds and not to sin again tookie has kept himself away from the gang culture inside the jail so he is atoning for his crime's .so in a true christian gesture he should be given clemacy.

We do disagree. Its a funny type of atonement, when the convicted murderer does not even " atone " by giving the families of the victims the degree of comfort that would come from an apology. Ot a confession at least.

Its a funny atonement when the founder of the Crips, a large group of killers and drug dealers did not rat out any of his friends. That makes the Crips think he's still a good guy, as they're still walking around, free, up to no good.

A large part of this guy's good deeds are a truce between -- his gang of killers and drug dealers, and the Bloods, the other large gang of killers and drug dealers. Better than nothing true, as gang violence is not good, but more akin to having a truce among mafia families. I never heard of a mafia don being offered the Nobel Peace Prize.

This guy has done some good from his celebrity cell in San Quentin. But too his last breath, he brazens it out and does not take responsibilty. Even some who strongly oppose the death penalty are not all that sympathetic to this particular prisoner on death row.

If the death penalty is to apply to anyone, then it must apply to someone who killed four innocents in cold blood like this guy did, who founded an entire society of killers.

Even the supposed good works he has done in jail are balanced out by his refusal to acknowledge what he has done-in itself a bad, bad,thing.

seems he agree's with you there is no such thing as redemtion he just said no

He says he is innocent, but when do murderers admit their guilt? Rarely, very rarely.

And if he is innocent? It's not exactly unprecedented. When do innocent people admit their guilt?

but how many innocent people are alive today thanks to the truce i rem in the 80,s the blood letting was bad between these two gangs with many innocent people getting in the cross fire.
he says he's innocent and only he and god know the truth to this. One of the witness at his trial is serving time for murder in canada and funny enough it was during a robbery .
but no matter what its up to god to give him redemtion now we cant judge this man we have no right to

--And if he is innocent? It's not exactly unprecedented. When do innocent people admit their guilt?--

They don't. And innocents have indeed been executed. I just don't think that this guy is one of them.

With respects to capital punishment for murder, the possibility of executing an innocent man ( its very rarely a woman )is to me the argument that has meaning. But it is a strong, disturbing argument.

that would be " the only argument that has meaning. But it is a strong, disturbing argument. "

For me, the fact that innocents may be executed is reason enough not to have the death penalty - and to some extent punitive (rather than protective) sentencing of any kind.

Although it is not just that the argument against is so strong, but that the argument for is so embarrassingly weak. The two main arguments, deterrence and justice, are not very compelling to me.

The case for deterrence has at best not been made, at worst it has been demolished. And the arguments for justice tend to be equally strong arguments as to why we should not kill. There is no element of self-defence in our killing.

Besides, the potential and actual incidents of innocents being executed undermine any claim to justice, overall. Although I do agree that it seems unlikely to be the case here, there is always doubt even if it seems beyond doubt.

I think Tookie should not have been executed but he would stay in jail. In reality Tookie was the centerpiece to a large scale truce between the notourious Bloods and Crips two street gangs known for violence. Now in my opinion many street gang sets will begin to fight with one another again.

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